In this episode, medical director Dr. Ryan Jones shares how advocacy grounded in service, data and trust can turn frontline insight into meaningful change for patients and clinicians. She reflects on her path from internal medicine into physician leadership, the value-based care principles that expanded her impact beyond the exam room and the importance of ensuring clinicians have a voice in decisions that shape care. Dr. Jones describes how proactive population health strategies, risk stratification and consistent follow-up can identify patients who need more attention and replace cycles of reactive care with practical, personalized solutions. Through patient stories and examples of clinician-led policy change, she illustrates how listening, collaboration and simple interventions can improve access, strengthen trust and help teams deliver more consistent, evidence-based care.
Dr. Jones explains that advocacy means pursuing practical improvements on behalf of both clinicians and patients, from creating clinician programs that promote work-life balance to bringing care into the homes of people who cannot easily reach a clinic. Her introduction to value-based care in 2015 helped her see how ideas tested in one clinic could spread across markets and improve care at a broader scale.
She shares how data can help care teams focus on patients with the greatest needs and describes memorable cases in which a low-cost medication plan and a height-adjustable hospital bed helped prevent repeated emergency visits. These stories reinforce a central theme of the conversation: meaningful improvement often begins by understanding what is really driving a patient’s challenges and finding a simple, workable response.
The conversation also explores how clinician input becomes operational change. Dr. Jones recounts a frontline recommendation that led to audio-only visits being recognized as a way to close certain care gaps and improve access. She outlines her approach to advocacy: prioritize the issue, test whether it serves the greater good, build alignment with operational and finance partners, and bring leadership a clearly packaged solution.
Dr. Jones closes by encouraging clinicians to experiment with a focused idea, build allies and recognize the leadership influence they already have. Her current purpose is to help create a sustainable system that can care for patients and families in the future, with a consistent, evidence-based experience across every clinic.
ADIA MORRIS: Welcome to Clinician Real Talk, the show where we explore what really shapes care, not from the outside, but from the people living it every day. Clinicians see things others don't. They notice early signals and feel system strain before it shows up in a dashboard. Today we're exploring advocacy as a catalyst for system improvement. Humble, practical advocacy driven by real patient needs. Ryan, welcome to the show. So good to have you.
DR. RYAN JONES: Thank you for having me. I'm excited to be here.
ADIA MORRIS: So you grew up rooted in service and your dad was a minister, right? And that shaped how you show up for others. So medical school drew you to internal medicine and to supporting older adults who need continuity and trust.
DR. RYAN JONES: So for me in my daily work, showing up as an advocate means being there to pursue things on behalf of both our clinicians and our patients. So whether it is supporting a new program that allows our clinicians to participate in a centralized on-call program that is paid and promotes work life balance, or if it's looking at one of our most rural counties where we have patients who can't make it into the office, so we build staff to go and take care of them in their homes. We meet those patients where they're at. No matter what system it is, whether it's supporting our clinicians or our patients, that is how I show up as an advocate each and every day.
ADIA MORRIS: Awesome. When did you realize your voice could shape care beyond the exam room?
DR. RYAN JONES: Well, it's funny, in 2015, I joined Optum. And that's when I was first introduced to this concept of value-based care. As I started to learn about value-based care and realized that we needed to move from a system where rewards revolved around volume, to a system where the people with the best outcomes are the most successful, I started to raise my hand and say, I want to be a part of this. I want to try out new workflows and new processes that can help bring this new way of taking care of patients to the bedside. So as I started to get involved, I realized that the best practices that we were coming up with in my clinic were being replicated in other clinics throughout the Dallas Fort Worth area. Fast forward, here we are 10 years later, part of Optum. I have colleagues from coast to coast who I've built relationships over the years with, and you see that same type of best practice sharing and spreading. It's a really fun thing to be a part of.
ADIA MORRIS: Yeah, I can see that. So, who do you feel you advocate for most often, patients, clinicians, or your community?
DR. RYAN JONES: In my role, I'm a medical director, and as a physician leader most of my day is spent working with the clinicians. But in that work, everything that we do, whether it's about coming up with tools to help the clinician get through their day more easily or implementing protocols to ensure all of our patients receive consistent screenings when they come through the door, it's the patient that this all centers around at the end of the day.
ADIA MORIRS: So you mentioned some things about systems. You're passionate about using data to ensure consistency in care, especially for the sickest patients. So let's dig into that. What patterns or patient stories made you realize that the system needed to change?
DR. RYAN JONES: Sometimes you don't know what you're missing until you see what's out there. So once I started working in this value space and seeing the data that we have at our fingertips, I realized we can't go back to the old way. So we have tools. One in particular is called the Optum Risk Stratification Tool. So, it takes all of our data and uses machine learning to tell us who our sickest patients are. And we focus in on and give the most consistent care to that 1 to 2% of the population who needs it the most. Once you start practicing this way, you realize- for me, the light bulb went off. You realize, this is a better way to deliver care.
ADIA MORRIS: You treated, I think you have a story, you treated a patient whose life was transformed by proactive, coordinated care, preventing years of hospital cycling. Can you share a little bit more about how that unfolded?
DR. RYAN JONES: Yes, this is a patient who will always stick with me. So she was a professor at an Ivy League school, successful career. She developed a serious autoimmune condition and found herself, when she came to my practice, in this revolving door of the hospital system, going to the hospital in and out every single week. So we started to build a relationship with her, develop trust, and we realized that a condition called gastroparesis was taking her to the emergency room time after time. And there was one medication in particular that the ER was giving her that made things better, but it was given through an IV. So we did our research, figured out that we could give the same medication intramuscularly in the clinic, cost about $10 a vial. So we prescribed that medicine for her. She kept it on hand. She learned the early warning signs that this was starting to flare, and she had a free pass to come into the clinic whenever she needed to. So many times, it is just taking the time to find simple solutions that change the lives of our patients. So she's one that I won't ever forget.
ADIA MORRIS: Yeah, that's awesome. I mean, thinking about the cost of an ER visit versus coming to the clinic, that's huge. I mean, that's huge for someone. Especially, and also the permission to know that they can come in when they need to, that's really huge too. I can imagine folks who are like, I don't want to, I don't know, am I crying wolf this time, or should I go somewhere else? So that's really, that's an awesome story to hear. When you elevate a patient story to Optum leadership, what signals help them understand it reflects a larger system opportunity?
DR. RYAN JONES: This is an interesting question. So when I elevate patient stories, I really use that as a time to celebrate and to reflect on the great work that we're doing. Because we are here operating in a broken health care system and there are so many things around us that need to change. It's important that we tell these stories and that we celebrate the work that we're doing, and we make sure everybody else knows about the impact that we're having one patient at a time.
ADIA MORRIS: And how is that received, generally, when you start that way?
DR. RYAN JONES: It energizes the team. And it's fun to see your own stories told, and it's also wonderful to see stories from around the country that are happening every day.
ADIA MORRIS: Yeah, so you get to share nationally, things that are happening nationally as well.
DR. RYAN JONES: Yeah.
ADIA MORRIS: Awesome. So you've said that being part of Optum expanded your world, connecting you with clinicians nationwide and giving you a broader voice. Let's explore that a little more. How does the organization create true pathways for clinician input?
DR. RYAN JONES: So, there are two things that anchor me to Optum. You've heard me mention the first one, and that is value-based care. The second is physician and APC leadership. So, Optum is committed to being a clinician-led organization, and this is important. This matters. So, I know and I've experienced that when important decisions are made, you have a clinician at the table, someone who has been at the bedside and knows what it's like to deliver this type of care. So that's very important. And I encourage everyone to ensure that you understand what medical leadership looks like in your community and how decisions are made and how they go through the organization. The other thing that I would highlight is the fact that we do have opportunities, through listening sessions and surveys, to collect that feedback. And those, we are listening, and we are reading every word of the survey. We have to have realistic expectations. Because there's so much to fix, but we're chipping away at it one problem at a time to make this the best place to work.
ADIA MORRIS: Yeah, awesome. What's an example of your feedback turning into operational change?
DR. RYAN JONES: So, one recent win that comes to mind revolves around our policy for closing care gaps. The reality is that sometimes it is hard to engage patients and it's hard to get them into the office for a face-to-face visit. So one of our physicians came forward with a compelling case, backed by data, suggesting that many of our care gaps can be effectively closed with an audio-only visit, a telephonic visit. And the reality is a telephonic visit is better than no visit at all. At the end of the day, we ended up updating and changing that policy. And so this was a great example of a time where we could make a simple change, that was practical and made sense, and ended up resulting in better access for our patients and makes it easier for our physicians and APCs to do their job. So this was a great example of frontline clinicians coming up with solutions that make this a better workplace.
ADIA MORRIS: Was it as simple, the conversation as simple as like, we just need to talk to people so what are the channels that we have to do so? Or did somebody already come in with that idea and think, can we just talk to them on the phone?
DR. RYAN JONES: Somebody came up with the idea and realized that they were reaching some of their patients that way, but they weren't getting the credit for it. So we were able to kind of take it to that next level and make it official.
ADIA MORRIS: You shared that what keeps you going is being able to interact with your patients and your mission, wanting a system your kids, parents, and patients can rely on. So let's talk about meaningful reward. What felt most validating when Optum leadership acted on your recommendations?
DR. RYAN JONES: So for me, the most exciting part is when I get to go back and celebrate the win with the team. Each and every time I think about the things that have been accomplished, these ideas don't start with me. I am just lucky enough to be in a position where I can create traction and momentum within the organization to get things pushed through the channels that they need. And that takes experience in an organization of this size. But at the end of the day, I love being able to pass the torch back to the person or the team where the idea started and giving credit where credit is due.
ADIA MORRIS: Do you celebrate with donuts?
DR. RYAN JONES: Sometimes. Everybody loves donuts.
ADIA MORRIS: Obviously, the ones with the sprinkles are the best. How does investment in your leadership growth shape your commitment?
DR. RYAN JONES: Optum does an outstanding job of investing in their leaders. So I take advantage of every opportunity that comes my way. These opportunities are so enjoyable and so well done. One piece that I always highlight as the best part of these opportunities is the ability to network and get to know your colleagues from across the country and those are lasting relationships that will continue to build. These opportunities greatly strengthen my commitment to the organization. Not only do they make me a better leader, but these are things that affect me on the personal side. So it has made me a better mom and a better wife and a better friend. So I find a lot of fulfillment in the investment in our leaders.
ADIA MORRIS: Do you have an example of how that's affected your personal life as well? Like you mentioned it making you a better mom and a friend. Like how does that, taking advantage of these leadership opportunities, how does that trickle down into those relationships?
DR. RYAN JONES: So one part of the personal development that I really enjoy is understanding my personality type or my enneagram. And so doing work to identify who I am as an individual. And also, I take the test home and have my husband take the test, and it can change the way that you approach each individual in your life. And so having that knowledge is very powerful.
ADIA MORRIS: Yeah, and I imagine there's like a feedback loop also when it comes back around to interacting with patients. You remember, maybe this person isn't the same type as me. Maybe they have a different way of relating with folks.
DR. RYAN JONES: That’s so true.
ADIA MORRIS: That's really cool. One more question along this line. What does it look like to truly feel seen as a clinician at Optum?
DR. RYAN JONES: To me, feeling seen is knowing that my voice is heard. Time after time, I've experienced nothing but openness and receptiveness from my leadership on pursuing the opportunities that are most important for us.
ADIA MORRIS: That's amazing and not always true at all organizations. That's really cool. So advocacy becomes draining when it goes unheard. And you've mentioned how often, you mentioned often that you feel heard. Advocacy becomes draining when it goes unheard, but sustainable when clinicians and operations move in sync. So what structures at Optum help you advocate without burning out?
DR. RYAN JONES: So we are part of a large organization. And I'll tell you, I never thought that I was going to be part of a Fortune 4, Fortune 5 company. I used to pride myself on being the big fish in the little pond. Here, and now here I find myself in the ocean, and it is an exciting place to be. I think I've learned over time how to navigate the organization, and I continue to hone in on those skills. But one of the most important things to do is to first, prioritize what areas you want to focus on and where you want to drive change. The next thing that I do is I ask around and I make sure that this isn't just something that I want, but this is something that is important to the greater good. I get impact and allies from people like my operational partners and my finance partners. And when we start to put our heads together around an idea, we come up with a better solution than any of us could have developed on our own. And then I package it up into a nice presentation with solutions outlined that I can take up the chain to leadership. And I find, more often than not, that this is a successful way to move things through the organization and really enact change.
ADIA MORRIS: How does proactive population-based care reduce friction for clinicians?
DR. RYAN JONES: So in our world of population health management, we use data to put at the fingertips of our clinicians the information that they need to drive the best outcomes in their patients. Some of this is standardized and structured. And we want you to know when you come to join us that we are here to deliver a consistent evidence-based experience for our patients, every patient, every time. This allows the clinicians, the person in the exam room, to focus on the person in front of them and to build that relationship and gain the trust of the patient. And that's really the fun part, help your patients make meaningful changes in their lives.
ADIA MORRIS: And what advice would you give clinicians who worry their input won't matter?
DR. RYAN JONES: I will continue to reassure you that your voice is going to be heard here. But I encourage you to experiment. Pick a little something that you want to drive change in and work to get the support of those around you and of your leaders and see what an impact you can have. Every single clinician is a leader. Your team is looking up to you, your pod is looking up to you, and the leadership shadow that we cast is very important. So it's important that we take seriously, that position.
ADIA MORRIS: You've shared some really hopeful insights about how clinicians can help patients navigate their care with more confidence, especially around building strong primary care relationships, timely follow-ups and cognitive screenings later in life. I'd love to hear how you guide patients through these moments.
DR. RYAN JONES: So we've seen a shift in primary care. And over the years, patients stopped relying on their primary care team as home base. And so we are doing a lot of work and education to remind our patients that we want to be the quarterback. We want to help them navigate this complex health system and really to hold their hand every step of the way. So whether it's seeing them soon after a hospital visit or helping them pick the best specialist for a certain condition that may need care outside of the primary care office, we want to be there every step of the way.
ADIA MORRIS: Yeah, awesome. And how do you talk to patients about things like calling primary care first, checking in within 72 hours after a hospital stay, or the value of dementia screenings after 65, in a way that feels reassuring, empowering, and doable for them?
DR. RYAN JONES: So we start by building a relationship with the patient. And we know that in a value-based world, we have to give the primary care clinicians more time with the patients, to get to know them and to build that trust. Once the trust is built, we start acting like a broken record. And we tell them every time we see them about all of the things that you just mentioned, which are really the cornerstone of our care model. Over time, it starts to see in, and we start to see patterns change, and this is when we really start to move the needle on better outcomes for our population.
ADIA MORRIS: I think a lot of us can testify that all those reminders really do help us to stay on track with things. What approaches have you found most effective for helping patients understand that these steps aren't just tasks, but pathways to feeling safer, more connected, and more in control of their health?
DR. RYAN JONES: It's very important that we learn what motivates our patients.
ADIA MORRIS: Good point.
DR. RYAN JONES: And once you understand that, then you can start to tie in the different treatment plans and the screening tests that we recommend, to the why. And that's when the light bulbs start to go off for the patient and you really gain that commitment to the work. Again, I'm going to go back to that analogy or that image of holding hands through the journey. I'm there with you with your checklist because I'm asking you to do a lot of things for your health and I'm asking you to get a lot of tests done to make you live a healthier life. But I've got to be there every step of the way with you.
ADIA MORRIS: And what have you found, if you or your team have any stories of what you found has motivated different patients?
DR. RYAN JONES: For a lot of patients, it's family.
ADIA MORRIS: Sure.
DR. RYAN JONES: And they might have a specific example. I want to be able to get down on the floor and play with my grandkids, or I want to be able to walk my daughter down the aisle at her wedding. So I think family is one of the most compelling reasons that people…
ADIA MORRIS: Absolutely. So, Ryan, was there a defining moment in your career when you realized your impact would come through leading clinicians rather than treating patients?
DR. RYAN JONES: So, this was a gradual transformation for me. And as I mentioned earlier, the light bulb went off when we started talking about value-based care. And as I started to raise my hand more, I got more responsibility. In my market in the Dallas Fort Worth area, we went through a period of rapid growth, and the job started getting too big. And I came to a crossroads where I had to make a decision, was I going to continue down this leadership path or continue to see the patients? And I love the work that I'm doing in the leadership space and do recognize the larger impact that that can have. And so it was a tough decision, but one that I feel confident in. The other thing that you run into, in primary care, you reach a point where being in the office one day a week is not really the best for your patients. And so I had to be honest with myself in recognizing that there was probably a selfish part of me that was wanting to hold on to that piece. But at the end of the day, I feel that I made the right decision.
ADIA MORRIS: Awesome. How do you help teams stay connected to purpose when the workload gets heavy?
DR. RYAN JONES: So we spend a lot of time talking about the mission and the values of the organization and we have to take time out to reflect on the good work that we've been doing, to tell these stories about the individuals who are impacted and to spread that. Because it is heavy work, but there is so much to be celebrated, and everyone needs to hear those stories.
ADIA MORRIS: Yeah, definitely. So what is your why right now? Has it shifted from when you started?
DR. RYAN JONES: My why is doing everything in my power to ensure that we create a system and sustain a system that can take care of my parents and my children and my patients in the future because they need, they are going to need this care and they deserve this care. And we have the pieces of the puzzle that are needed to build the system and to really bring it to life.
ADIA MORRIS: Has the why shifted since you started?
DR. RYAN JONES: The vision shifts over time. Right now, one of my major areas of focus is building a medical group where, as a patient, you know that if you walk through the doors of any clinic with our sign on the door, you are going to receive a consistent, evidence-based approach each and every time, no matter who you're in the exam room with. And so I feel very energized and excited about bringing that dimension to the patients in my community.
ADIA MORRIS: So shifting gears a little bit, can you share a patient experience that helped leadership understand the need for change and what about it signaled this was bigger than one case?
DR. RYAN JONES: One thing that we do is we stratify our patients based on their illness burden and based on some predictive factors that we have. And then as a medical group, we have committed to seeing our sickest patients more frequently. Sometimes there are patients on that list who I don't expect to see there. And the data is very predictive. Our goal is to see 80% of those patients every single month in primary care. And when we start to have these frequent interactions with the patient, it really transforms the care. So, that patient who I used to see on my schedule and think, oh my goodness, I'm going to be an hour behind for the rest of the day because we have so many things that we're trying to address in a short period of time, it turns into a well-oiled machine. And so each month we are checking in, and we'll call them in between if needed. And we are working through all the items on their to do list and catching things early and really going from the old way of care, which was reactive, to the new way of care, which is a proactive approach to our population. It's a very fulfilling way to deliver care, and I can tell you that our patients also love it. So when I started doing this, it started getting around town that I was providing concierge care to the patients, because that's what it feels like to those patients who really need that extra attention.
ADIA MORRIS: Yeah, yeah, that's awesome.
DR. RYAN JONES: So one patient that comes to mind is a man who became part of my panel, and I hadn't seen him before, didn't know him. He came in and he had a very complicated case. He had received a gunshot wound at the age of 16. He was now in his mid-30s but wheelchair-bound, had multiple amputations, and again, a very complicated history, also in that loop of going to the hospital time after time. The data pointed us to him to say he needs monthly visits, although my clinical judgment would have also told me that. But he's somebody who we deployed our home resources to. Interesting story, when one of the wonderful nurse practitioners on our team went out to his home to see him, she was doing the normal things that you do on a home visit. So the first thing is you check the refrigerator. Make sure that they have the right types of food, that there's no signs of food insecurity. The second thing that you do is you look around for rugs and things that are going to pose a potential fall risk. And then the last thing that you do is you want to check out the patient's accommodations in the bathroom facilities. Do they have all of the tools that they need to safely complete their activities of daily living. So as they're walking back through the home to the bathroom, she catches a glimpse of his room. And in his room, she sees a hospital bed. And she notices right away that there's a big gap between the height of his wheelchair and the height of his hospital bed. And so she says, hey, can you show me how you transfer from one to the other? And to hear this nurse practitioner tell the story was really something. She said that he grabbed a hold of the sides of the chair, after putting some of his medical supplies and things that were connected to tubes on the bed, and then he, really, rocked himself backwards, and in an acrobatic-type movement, hoisted himself from the chair to the bed. And it became clear, this is why his tubes kept coming loose and why he kept ending up in the emergency room having to have urologic procedure after procedure. So again, we got this patient a new hospital bed that went up and down and he stopped going to the hospital. So it's the simple things, but digging in to really understand what's driving the problems that helps us to make a true difference in these patients' lives.
ADIA MORRIS: And that nurse practitioner knowing that they could bring that back to the team and say, hey, we need to do something about this. That's awesome. Thank you for that story. Ryan, thank you so much for being here. Thank you for sharing your stories and your insights and for showing what advocacy looks like when it's grounded in service, data, and trust. To our listeners, your voice matters, not someday, but today. Check the show notes for our clinician readiness quiz and subscribe for more candid conversations shaping the future of care. Until next time.